My big project of this year is opening a permanent teaching studio.
As I move forward with it, I’ve been giving a lot of thought to different approaches to learning to paint.
The Four methods
I think there are broadly four approaches to teaching skilled representational painting these days:
- Atelier training
- Workshops
- Online courses
- A local art teacher
1. Ateliers
There’s much to say about this that I don’t have time or space to go into today. But personally, I’m pretty sure that the atelier model is the most effective in teaching a comprehensive set of fundamental skills.
Accurate drawing, values, form, colour (well, maybe not colour so much) materials, history of a tradition – all of these things can be taught very effectively in a full time program, where you’re in the company of other people striving toward the same goals.
And I imagine that the shared journey is very motivating. It’s a lot of the reason I run an online art community of my own – so that both myself and the members have a group to be a part of.
It is very motivating, even online, so it must be even more so at an atelier.
At the same time, I do think atelier training comes with a certain aesthetic bias toward classicism. Whether you appreciate this or not is largely a personal position.
This training also comes in for some criticism of the homogeneity of its approach – all the artists are doing the same work.
But I think you need to look at what happens to the atelier people after they’ve finished and had some time to develop their individual voiced to judge that, and the best place I know to see that is the suggested donation podcast.
A look down the list of their interviews shows an incredible range of artistic voices, all of whom have a very high level of skill, and most of whom are atelier trained.
But here’s the thing: Even if we want to, few of us have the opportunity to put our lives on hold and go and study for three years or more.
Even fewer of us can afford it.
2. Workshops
I should point out that what I have to say about workshops here is meant to be taken in a very general way. There will, of course, be specific examples that are very different and much more effective.
From what I’ve seen (which admittedly is a fairly limited amount) a common model with a workshop is that attendees get to spend a few days in the company of a well known, highly skilled artist – an “art star”, even, sometimes.
The artist demonstrates, then the attendees try their hand at a similar kind of painting, with comments and advice from the artist as they go.
I’ll just come out and say it: I’m not at all convinced that this is an effective way to develop your skills.
If you attend a workshop like this you will pick up some knowledge, for sure.
But if they’re just demonstrating and describing what they’re doing as they go – well, frankly you won’t learn much that you can immediately apply.
The reason for this, I think, is that very often the instructor is much more painter than teacher.
They’ve developed skill in all the fundamentals of drawing and painting over many years, and are demonstrating their personal approach, as it is now. They’re vocalising what goes through they minds as they paint, explaining their decisions as they go.
If you don’t have a similarly high level grasp of the fundamentals, their specific techniques and approaches will probably not get the same effect for you as they do for them.
What you need is what got them to where they are now, not what they’re currently doing.
3. Online Training
I do quite a bit of this myself and have also taken quite a few online courses, so I’ve seen it from both sides.
Whilst it would be silly to contend that online training can ever compete with in-person training in terms of depth, it does have some distinct advantages – most of which are tied to convenience:
- Don’t have to travel
- Much, much cheaper
- Do it in your own time, rather than trying to cram in everything in a few days
- Go over things as often as you like
That could mean that you can learn more thoroughly than you can at a workshop, say, because you have the opportunity to constantly refresh your understanding of the content of the course.
The big disadvantage is that you’re not in the same room, so the instructor can’t see what you’re doing, what you’re getting right and what you’re getting wrong.
I’ve given workshops that have been attended by people who have already done some of my online training, so I know first hand that there are things I see and can instantly correct in a workshop that I would never know people were doing with the online only approach.
4. Learning with a local artist
I have no experience of this myself, either as a learner or a teacher, so it’s hard for me to comment.
But I think the effectiveness or otherwise will depend very much on the teacher.
Obvious advantages might be a very personalised approach without a set curriculum, instant personalised feedback – it could be a very effective way to learn. Perhaps the most effective.
The biggest disadvantage must be that if you don’t have someone good near you, this way will be unavailable to you.
And how do you judge if someone is a good teacher or not if you’re a beginner yourself? You can’t. Even if their work is impressive, they might be a terrible teacher.
So what about my approach?
The more I’ve thought about this, the more I’ve tended towards thinking that a hybrid approach will be the most effetive way for me to teach what I know.
If you already follow me, you’ll know I stress the importance of exercises and developing skill in the funamentals of painting and drawing. It is simply the most effective way not only to develop skill, but to develop your work and vision.
When I teach a workshop, I want to pass on an effective method of learning, not any specific technique.
So I look at it from a point of view of how many execises I can demonstrate effectively in the time, that will be the most relevant to the people there.
The exercises are backed up with video versions you can access any time, so hopefully you can get the best of both worlds, to an extent.
I’m not interested in teaching how I paint so much as in teaching what has got me to the point of being able to paint as I do now – what helped me make the most progress on the fundamental skills that underlie the work.
I think that’s the best way to ensure that you make progress.
Workshop schedule for 2020
I’m currently working on a workshop schedule for this year, which I’ll put up in the next update. I’m trying as much as I can to bear in mind all of the above thoughts as I do it, and to develop something that will best meet your needs.
Attendance on a workshop will also mean access to online course materials that can be followed as you have the opportunity to do them. Ongoing feedback will be an option too – low level for free, more engaged and regular feedback as a paid option.
I’m hoping to find a sweet spot that makes the most of all the approaches whilst minimising the disadvantages, and take into account what opportunities people generally have to study.
The main point is that it will be coordinated – there will be a progression of skill development, taught most effectively in a combination of in-person and online teaching.
That’s my idea. I’m near the beginning of evolving this method, so some things will change as it evolves. But a cornerstone of the approach I intend to take is that once you come to me, you will always have access to some level of support.
Of course I’ll continue to supply online-only teaching, because not everyone can manage the travel and financial comitment of a workshop.
But that too will hopefully be much better informed by the in-person teaching I do.
Wrapping up
I’ll update again soon with progress on finding the studio space, and will also flesh out the actual workshops I’m planning a little more in my next post.
Till then, I hope I’ve given you something to consider that might help you make your own decision about what kind of training will work best for you, whether you decide to get that training from me or someone else.
I would dearly love to hear what you think about this post, what has worked best for you and what hasn’t worked so well.
Any thoughts you have on how I can best arrange my teaching to give you best result – from a point of learning and convenience – will be very useful to me.
I want to make sure I develop my teaching inl ine with what you actually want and need, rather than just impose my own ideas.
So please do add any thoughts that come to mind in the comments.
Best wishes and thanks for reading,
Paul
Your comment ” I’m not interested in teaching how I paint so much as in teaching what has got me to the point of being able to paint as I do now” is a the most effective way I’ve learned different forms of art. I learned plein air in workshops that were taught in that manner. Shared personal experiences have the most impact. Having immediate feedback from fellow artists, students and the instructor while doing painting exercises was very valuable also. Also, when it’s dynamic it’s memorable.
The phrase that stood out there for me was “immediate feedback”. this is the achilles heel of online training I think, and I’m not sure how to get round it. It was very noticeable to me how different the feedback process is in a workshop. And quite often, as you say, I found that my feedback would become better through a conversation with someone, and I’d be able to put what I meant more clearly through the dialogue.
Art for Architects was the most impactful skills course I ever took in college. Exercises were structured to teach specific skills and sequenced so they built increasing mastery. There was no emphasis or judgment of style–or as little as possible. Techniques were isolated from one another. E.g. no outlines in shaded drawings, no shading in line drawings. Color was introduced by copying a collage of commercial paint chips. Late in the second semester, *compositional* style was introduced through a study of different psychological poles, e.g. introverted / extroverted, emotive / intellectual, etc. Every week, the best three or four project solutions from among the 60 students were tacked to the wall. There were two graduate student TA’s.
I agree with your suggestion that a hybrid approach may be best after that…. After a while, the most important thing is to practice. Workshops, at their best, give you a chance to walk in someone else’s shoes and be a beginner, all over again, incorporating others’ solutions into your practice.
Wow, Mimi that sounds like a wonderful course and must have been led by a knowledgeable teacher. Have you read Peak, or anythign else by Anders Ericsson? You’ve pretty much listed his requirements for effective practice there. I try very much to incorporate that appraoch into my own teaching. It’s an ongoing process, and one I hope very much to continue developing and getting better at.
….looking him up, now……..
that’s cool…… I’m more like Ericsson’s subjects than Ericsson 😉
As a teacher, I try to give assignments where figuring out and defining for oneself what, exactly is the nature of the problem, is part of the goal.
That sounds like an extremely good idea Mimi, thank you! (the part about leaving people to work something out for themselves I mean).
Funnily enough, I’ve just started doing that with my eldest boy’s reading and comprehension practice, so it should really have struck me sooner!
I think there might be a 5th way, the way you seem to have learned and which I also follow, which is the auto didact/self taught method. I watched you over the years set your own goals and curriculum and faithfully pursue every means of learning possible, from doing daily exercises based on books, to taking advantage of online/video opportunities, to in-person classes and mentoring in order to grow. Even your teaching seems to be a part of your development as an artist. Like you I set goals for myself and am persistent about working to learn, reaching out when I need help to experts who have the skill and knowledge I want when I get stuck and can’t go any further without help. You have been and still are one of those valuable resources for me on my journey!
Oh Jana, how could I have missed that one!? Thanks so much for pointing out something I really should have put at the top of the list – since isn’t that how most of us learn?
I think perhaps that since I was thingking about teaching I missed my blind spot 🙂
And yes, you’re absolutely right – teaching has very much been a aprt of my artistic development too. You must teach, do you? Theat was very perceptive!
And thank you so much for the kind words. I can’t tell you what it means to me when an accomplished artist says nice things about my teaching.
Hello my name is André Luiz P. dos Santos, I am a professor at a University Center in Brazil, where I teach visual arts classes for students of higher level. I was graduated from a very traditional university in my area that allowed me to appreciate paintings of the portrait and still life genres. The course I teach works in the distance learning modality. I have the best interest to exchange experiences with you, because I realize that our interests are the same, ie how to teach online in the best way possible. How about we exchange experiences in this regard? I strongly believe that the hard student can achieve great results. As for your post, it seems to me that hybrid teaching is the best way, but I really believe in distance learning. Thanks for the initiative.
Hi André, good to meet you! Yes I’d very much like to discuss this with you, it’s somethign I’m very interested in developing more myself. I feel we’re near the beginnings of a very new way of helping people and disemminating information, and sharing our experiences must certainly be a good thing.
Please feel free to email me or to fill out the contact form on my site here.
My favorite teachers have shared their “why’s”, not simply the “how’s” of their techniques.
Very good point Karlen, thank you!
I’ve only taken a couple of workshops, and don’t think I’d take any more. My feeling is that an instructor really needs to gave more depth of understanding of their students to effectively help them advance.
The last workshop I took, from an extremely competent and well-known artist who is also a friend taught me this. I asked for some general things to think about moving forward, and he said that since he’d only seen me do one drawing, he wasn’t sure what to recommend. (I don’t fault him, and appreciated his honesty.)
Contrast that to my teachers in France, where I spent 2 years. My drawing teacher gave me very sound advice on the exact same drawing from the workshop because he’d seen me progress over 2 years, and knew what I had learned (from him) in that time and what I needed to focus on.
I may try some online instruction, and would love to get some nentor-style feedback, but I think longer-term instruction is best.
Really excellent points Stuart, and I’ve no doubt you’re right. It’s very hard to give useful feedback to people if you don’t know them and the level they’re at.
One of the things I’m hoping to develop with people who learn with me is a longer term approach that incorporates, where possible, both online and face to face elements. Basing it on knowledge of the individual will certainly make it much more effective.
In an excellent book on neuroscience and teaching called “The Art of Changing the Brain” By James Zull, the author describes how new knowledge must be anchored to existing knowledge – that’s hard to do if you don’t know what someone’s existing knowledge is!
I think your comment that “Given the almost complete absence of any real art teaching at schools and universities, we need to look to other sources” is absolutely true!! I was a fine arts major in college at a liberal arts school, and I felt that I learned almost no real art skills. In grad school (for a non-art degree), I was fortunate enough to take an “Anatomy for Artists” class, and that was probably the best art class I’ve ever taken. To break down these two approaches…
Good approaches to teaching art: I felt that in the Anatomy for Artists class, my teacher focused on specific, measurable skills –ex) knowing how to identify, on the skin-level, what specific muscles look like & affect the form of the body. He had high expectations, and told us when we did not meet them, but was otherwise extremely supportive & nice.
What was really notable about him was that he appreciated & encouraged each students’ unique approaches / styles to learning. For example, he encouraged one student’s use of the ipad as a good way to keep track of notes of the muscle layers, and also the markmaking of another’s pencil markings. They were not forced into a homogeneity of style/preference that is common in atelier-style environment.
Also, he walked around and watched us while we drew, and told us about what he observed in each of our art styles. For me, it was that I take a little too long to put down any non-erasable marks! He would always say, “move onto the charcoal pencil now,” and I still hear that in my head when I do figure drawing.
Not so affective approaches: On the flip side, my college education I felt was not good in teaching me actual art skills — we were expected to have complicated modern-art-esque explanations for our *body of work,* when I did not even know how to properly utilize a specific medium. There was a lot of emphasis on intention, etc which I feel were too advanced for our level of work. We did not have a common understanding of what constituted as good art or good technique, so it was a very confusing process.
To finish, I really appreciate how you focus on specific techniques to improve & achieve the affect you want in painting! Especially color-matching and how to practice composition, etc. gives me very specific, measurable techniques to improve my painting. Thanks & cheers!
Thank you Alex, what an insightful comment! I also feel that degree level university programs tend to jump straight to the “having a voice” part without the building skill part first. So you end up with a lot of people who can conjure impressive-sounding justifications for what is, in the end, mostly meaningless work that is largely unrelated to the explantions.
Your anatomy teacher sounds wonderful. Very often it seems that best teaching in arts in universities these days is in some form of applied arts.
I just think that this is awesome.. a teacher who really wants to reach their students.. I agree with the ‘whys’ and ‘hows’ comment..’ why’ really helps one understand more effectively.. I wish I could attend an atelier or have a working mentor to go to to ask why or how or both.. I have been mostly self taught and am forever guessing my way through a painting and never really knowing how I got to the successful ending.. so the path is a struggle each time..(more frequent practice helps this I believe)
I had a watercolor teacher who could get ‘prickly’ sometimes but he was the best teacher I’d ever had because he took the time to explain the how/why and even when communication lines got crossed I was not afraid to say “I don’t get what you mean ” and we’d try again. I ended up assisting him on a regular basis.. And that was a great way to learn. You are onto something.. I wish you the best of luck!
Kim
Thank you Kim!
I do think that a certain amount of feeling your way is inevitable when painting. Many times I’ve thought that I’d evolved a repeatable process for picture making only have it fall flat sooner or later. Perhaps some of that is just due to evolving sensitivity and higher expectations. But it certainly happens, particularly, I find when I’m reaching for something I haven’t really done before or my work is changing.
There is also a level of understanding of basic fundamentals that makes complete disaters less likely though, I think!
I like the sound of your watercolour teacher – well, apart from the prickliness perhaps 🙂
I agree with Jana Bouc that there is a 5th way, the auto didact method. One of my favorite artists, Clyde Aspevig, used this method. It can take a very long time if used literally, however.
There is also a 6th way, and that is through books, which is in many ways similar to the online training.
What I am doing is to use all of the methods I can, excluding only the atelier method. I wish it were possible for me to attend an atelier, because that is the fastest way to achieve a high level of skill.
One problem that a teacher has is that all of their students are going to be at a different skill level. That makes planning for a progression approach tricky.
One approach that I have not seen anyone attempt yet is the live online classroom. My idea is that video conferencing could be used to provide two way audio and video in a format similar to the types of lessons that a local teacher provides. This would require a separate webcam and computer with the webcam focused on the student’s painting and palette. The teacher could do demonstrations by having a similar setup.
When I study in person with Yarnell and with Davidson, they rotate around the classroom from one student to another to provide instruction and feedback. In between, the students work to apply whatever instruction the teacher previously provided.
It seems to me that this approach would combine the best of all worlds. A good teacher who can master this approach would provide a great service to the art community. Essentially a remote atelier without as much overhead. The student’s progress would only be limited by the time they invest. I believe that it could be cost-effective for both the student and the teacher!
Now that’s a very interesting idea Mike! I’m taking it as a challenge to figure out how to do it, technically.
The most obvious difficulty is that the attendee’s webcams (phone cameras, whatever) would need to be of reasonably good quality and set up properly.
But I wonder if something can be tried more simply, to begin with? As part fo the Threads program we already have monthly meet ups where we basically video conference. It’s not a huge step from there to show each others’ easels.
Hm.
And thanks for mentioning Aspevig, his work is lovely.
I actually would classify learning from book as a part of being self taught. I think of being self taught as taking the responsibility for shaping your your own curriculum with whatever resources you can find, without actually studying with a teacher.
I have taken classes but did not get much out of it. Good artists – bad teachers. Many students in the class gave me little time with the teacher. Expensive and long travel time. I felt that I needed to practise on my own and get feed-back occcationally. It was worthwile to send in a photo of my work to an internet artist and ask specifically about my immediate problems. I got a good feed-back in form of a video clip with demo. I also got suggestions of good teachers on internet. This is how I prefer to go about now. I would also like to occasionally spend some time discussing my work with someone who can and likes to teach.
Thank you for all the good instructions.
Yes I’m afraid that can often be the case Ulf. Painting and teaching are completely different skill sets, and a good art teacher must have both, it seems to me.
I have been considering some form of crit-based teaching. In a sense, I do it already in the Mastering Colour facebook group. So that can work well, I think.
Purtroppo non capisco l’inglese. Ha questi argomenti in italiano?
Possiamo provare, con Google translate 🙂
Paul,
Great questions….a tribute to learning and teaching I feel. I have not had a brick and mortar place to study art, I learned with an online institution which I learned a lot! I wanted to learn, but didn’t have an art school close by….So searched on the web to see if I can learn a thing or two….I found Virtual Art Academy with Barry Raybould. I found his learning style with his building blocks of learning quite informative.
One has to be self discipline to go at your own pace and follow instructions. I have spent 6 years with this program and followed all his instructions. I was able to ask questions to fellow students and him. The answers were not immediate, but many were to read past assignments and was able to find my way….Online worked for me, only cause I am willing to learn and have patience in my work. I also contribute my original college work in practice makes perfect. When I didnt understand a concept, I would research it within the website or on the web. Thus how I found you! I was searching for how to mix and understanding color theory a bit more….Thus, I am still following you cause your theory on Munsel is spot on. Barry also follows Munsel, but wants you to mix your own and play around and try new things…
Being an scientific person with a BS degree in Medicine, I need somethings concrete. This I can not change. There had to be a way to explain color theory so I could not understand it. I finally between you and Barry, I found it..I wrote a blog on it Its all about the chemistry of paint!
Therefore, I applaud your intent of finding a well rounded teaching style. It is all how the students can learn. Are they visual, studious, practical, imaginary, try by fire, take initiative or more.
I think if you blend text, speech, visual, exercises, and follow up on students attempt to your suggestions would be grand. I know that when I do take a class or workshop I intend to get something out of it. Whether its one incite, one question answered, or practice a technique. I might place that new knowledge into my way of proceeding with art. I love art, cause its a lifetime learning experience. The more you learn and possibly use, the more I feel I grow as an artist.
That’s the point right? Hope I helped
Thank you Cindy, I hadn’t come across Barry before. I love to see what other people are doing online.
Certainly, I’ve noticed the people who are the most motivated to learn and do so regularly make the most progress with the online stuff I do – but then, that’s probably true of any teaching. Perhaps you need to be a little more motivated to stick with online training.
I’m very happy to hear that you’re finding Munsell useful!
In a way, all artists have to be self-taught. Assuming a dedicated student, the speed of progress can vary. Key to steady progress as an art student is getting individual, specific feedback from an instructor or other knowledgeable person. In addition, the feedback has to be at the student’s level. In a physical classroom or atelier, the student has the instructor right there to comment and question, and student progress then depends on the instructor’s teaching ability.
Workshops, it depends. I took a workshop from an “art star” and, due to some weather and other problems, there were only 9 attendees. We all received individual attention and he even critiqued paintings not done in the workshop. That was wonderful, but other workshops I have taken have been too large for that level of attention. Annoyingly, there seems to be a large contingent of workshop attendees that treat workshops as an entertainment, not an opportunity for study.
With online classes, the chance for individual critique mostly disappears. The best learning experience I’ve had in an online class was for beginning-mid level oil painters. The instruction started with a photograph of a still life set-up to paint. We were given two weeks to work on it, with pointed but general instruction. Then there was a critique day, for which we emailed a photo of our work. All the paintings were posted so we could see what classmates were doing. There were over 100 students, so he selected five paintings, and then very thoroughly went over each. Since we were doing the same image at mostly the same level, this turned out to be very effective.
Other online classes have been of the ‘watch me do this’ variety, sometimes with an add-on price for some separate critique not integrated into the program. Artist videos are also interesting, and watching can be helpful for technical details, like how to hold a brush, but seldom seem to translate into any real learning for anyone I know.
I will be fascinated to find out more about any program you design!
Thanks Christine. Yes, I’d agree – to a large extent we’re all self taught since it’s our own willingness to learn and more iportantly practice independently that makes the real difference.
I also agree that personal feedback at the right level is key.
I think more than ten people would be too many for a workshop. At least, for me, I’d feel I wasn’t giving people the attention they needed if there were more. At my last workshop there we six attendees and worked out really well.
I have had a month-long with someone who taught in an atelier, many workshops, some video training, and a local teacher who is very good at painting and teaching! In the beginning, the local teacher, and one-day-a-week classes (4 to 5 hours each class) were the BEST, not only for learning the how’s and why’s of painting, but for developing a core group of art-friends and fellow learners which remain to this day. Next was the month long as you couldn’t divert or escape your best and worst instincts. This was tightly managed tutoring and I benefitted greatly from being pushed past what I knew was possible to achieve. Video’s are next, and I love watching a skilled person paint especially when they are at the same time able to speak about what their mind and hands are doing! Workshops are last. My experience has been with 2-5 day experiences. I often feel cheated and unhappy at the end of these with the exception of two experiences with people who were interested in teaching, would tolerate my questions, and were quick to see where I was struggling and had a next step for me to explore to build my creative process from their unique viewpoint, e.g. one person told me to put down the brush and use a palette knife to underscore the message re colour, and another instructed me on colour pre-mixes and then what exactly to do with them!
Wow Marilyn you’ve tried it all 🙂
I’m sorry to hear that you’ve had a bad experience at sme workshops. I think you’re right, it comes mostly down to whether the artist teaching has a genuine interest in teaching.
Presumably it’s a contiuum, with artists who love to teach at one end, and artists who just demonstrate for money at the other! Unfortunately I suppose there’s no real way to tell which is which without actually attendng the workshop!
My response to the workshop criticism, Paul, is that everyone gets out of a workshop what they can grasp at their current level. Obviously, if a beginner painter takes an advanced workshop they will struggle to gain from it. But most teachers talk about a lot of stream of consciousness stuff as they paint and the attendees will glean what they are ready for and taking the same workshop a year later (or re-watching an online tutorial video a year later) the person will probably get a whole new set of a-ha moments.
I found you originally when I googled “How to finish a painting” and bought the video for Time’s Unfolding. I still don’t know how to finish a painting, but my starts are getting better!
Also, I find it far more instructive to paint along than just watch.
The online possibilities are amazing now!! OMG, when I was 30, “online” didn’t even exist yet; there was no youtube, no 200 tutorials for acrylic pouring etc. You could watch Bob Ross and that was about it. Or go $40k in the hole for art school… I buy a lot of videos from artists. And I look forward to watching them again and again. I also take a lot of workshops. The main thing is to take a workshop that is about something i really want to do or emulate. I took a Landscape workshop and my paintings got worse and worse because I realized I just want to paint still lifes right now.
I did one semester of atelier-like study at the School of Representational Art in Chicago and i hated that. They were like, erase everything and move that nose over a millimeter and a half!
A millimetre and a half! That’s funny 🙂
I take your point about workshops. I just worry that too many artists giving them are talking about what they do at the level they’re currently at, whcih few if any of the attendees will be. I’ve bought a few online ones that were like that, in my opinion.
And yes, there are amazing possibilities now. Go back even just ten years and there was almost nothing.
I made a friend online who loves teaching in oils. The first thing she asked me was what are my aspirations/goals and accordingly she went about teaching me. I admire her patience and the hours she spent pointing out my mistakes and how to correct them. She also referred me to this site.
Another friend online helped me tremendously with the oil pastel techniques.
And yet another artist helped me really take a hard look at realistic drawing in graphite.
Atelier classes are great for beginners to intermediate artists where I started with painting on material years ago. I find that a combination of feedback, teaching videos, practice and a willingness to learn/improve are key to success.
Thanks for sharing your expertise with us, Paul. All the best for your teaching in 2020.
Thanks Christel 🙂 I’m very happy to hear you were referred here by someone who obviously knows what they’re talking about – yes, I agree, it’s very important to know where someone wants to go.
I appreciate your gentle ways Paul, and your introspection and questions to those who are your students or potential students. I think to be a good teacher, one has to question their teachings . See how to hone, meld, shed, shape in best ways for the students.
Just a couple thoughts. I’m self taught for several decades. Recently took a five day life drawing course with an ‘art star.’ As in every profession there are such talented people but that doesnt mean they know how to teach.
This particular artist spent most of the five days drawing the model [he is a fabulous draftsman and anatomist] with us ohbserving. Then we would go back to our drawing.
However i learned most by talking to far more experienced students who were dropping hints and tips all over the place. [dont try to draw the crook of the arm, draw the negative space and move on. This worked!]
Would I do another five day course with an ‘art star’. Id FIRST have to look into their teaching style and testimonials beforehand –to make sure their teaching style was methodical, in depth, structural, whether about color, draftsmanship, glazing, graphic design, whatever
i, like others here, need a structured approach. Here’s how to do this, do this and then this step by step. Practice is a given. Robert Henri’s book on observations of light is popular all these decades later, because it is structural; see light this way; see this light on metal this way, see this light on water this way. Not detailing everything but teaching one to see by saying structurally what light and shade to look for around anything
I tend to read book on art for children, for it is very structural usually
I think ‘self taught’ is top notch. Know too many souls who have never painted/scupted/danced/written/performed again because a prof at university was too harsh. The world is hard enough. I’d prefer to work with, learn from people who are phlegmatic/ calm, not ego driven. There’s far enough and away in the world more than enough of that
Youre on the right track and I like that people said self taught and hybrid approach are likely just right
Thank you for asking us. Im not sure I added anything useful but I’m glad you asked us to think this through with you
thank you, you certainly have cntributed something useful.
I actually think everyone benefits from a structured approach to learning. If it’s npot structured then it won’t fit together and parts of it on’t make sense, I think. Learning and skill development is sequential.
And that’s a very good point about doing research forst on workshops. A few emails to the artist concerned would probably be a good idea, too.
I wish you the best of luck with the new and exciting plans! I am teaching online nowadays and absolutely love the possibilities of it. How amazing is it that nowadays we can teach and learn from artists from all over the world.
I learned my paintings skills through none of your categories (LOL sorry!). I am self-taught and never even took a course. An well-known online forum has been a great help in my early days – this was before online courses or social media was even a thing. I just learned by doing and just kept going!
Thanks Sophie,
I’ve been following your online developments very closely, believe me!
Yes, self taught is undoubtedly the most common way to learn, I wasguilty in this post of the very thing I advise people not to do – look at theings from my own perspective rather tna everyone elses! I was thinking really about ways to teach. I’m mostly self taught myself!
Knowing that you are too makes you’re work doubly impressive.
aw thanks!
The way you’re doing it now is fantastic. Though we’re not there, we can still communicate with you through the chat.
Your practical experience is worth much more than learning from class, as you can share your frustrations, bad experiences and so on, to come to the conclusion of why you do something the way you’re teaching it. It’s usually through practical experience that we learn the most.
For theory you can always point the artists to good books like Virgil Eliot’s Traditional Oil Painting, Color and Light by James Gurney, The Painters Handbook by Mark David Gottsegen etc. to get technical information about paints, canvases etc. Also to good resources thats on youtube that you find gives the best advice or examples.
We’re looking forward on more training and learning from you. All of the best for the new en devour you want to do
Olof
Thank you Olof, that’s really good to hear!
Your approach is great Paul, sharing your journey of learning will help others to learn as well. I love what you do (works for me) and just follow your heart. I always did with a lot of simple faith and it has been successful for me.
In my own experience I go along with Jana Bouc that there is that 5th way and Mike Strickland about learning from books, but one needs to be disciplined in getting out of books what is useful. I have studied books a lot and only took out information from authors who gave the same information.
Researching, exploring, practicing the craft of fine art in oil paintings for 10 years now I feel I am always at the beginning. I learned a lot from numerous sources over the years and come to the conclusion that one has to in the end learn on their own. Practice is the key and to find your inner teacher and style. Develop good eyesight and compare your art with artist who are excellent in their craft. Be open to all type of art and instructions and just use what you find useful.
Loved hanging out in Creative Triggers (about 2013) and learned from Paul to slow down in line drawing. Very helpful when I draw.
I found that workshops give you limited learning. Yet, not a waste of time, but perhaps a little too expensive. I did take away things that are useful to me by keeping notes and lots of pictures.
My mind is very active like a baby goat jumping all over the place. To top that with being very analytical I have to work hard on staying focused which is not easy being an information junky.
When you open your eyes, you see a lot. I can actually see better now because my eyes look at art a lot.
Seeing something in person is very different then seeing it on a computer screen. However, knowing this, one can develop their own interpretation since it is almost impossible to copy anything because we have our unique visual perception.
Just started reading “Art and Illusion” by E. H. Gombrich. At the heart of things, I am an academic first and very curious about everything while I love drawing and painting.
Had similar experiences as Christine and Marilyn (thank you for your posts)
All methods (except online learning) at different times of my life have benefitted me well. I hesitate to do an online learning course because it is tied to FB, of which I am not fond because of having to give personal information to set up an account. If there is a
better way to connect without FB or having to give one’s information, I would be interested.
Hi Paul, I was very fortunate to have a year in a small atelier. I would have gone four years but the school moved to Maui after my first year and I moved to the Oregon Coast. I got a good solid year of drawing in and then I started to teach myself to paint once I moved. I think I found your site about that time, along with others. I also started plain air painting. My first paintings were beyond awful but I just kept going out to paint. I really like learning online but I have to agree with the drawbacks you mention. I think I need to move to England for a year so I can take your workshops! In the meantime, I will continue on with your excellent program.
Hi Paul,
I admire your honest approach to teaching. I have been to art school but studied goldsmithing rather than painting as I wanted to learn a practical skill set and ended up working in a craft for several years. My experience with workshops on painting all depend on whether the artist can teach. Teaching involves communicating with your audience and actually being interested in them and wanting them to achieve results.So often the “Art Stars” are not that interested or invested in their students which leaves their students feeling frustrated.
I have studied with artists that are generous and great teachers but I always had a plan myself of what it was that I needed to gain from them.I have a degree in teaching as well as art and the best teachers to my knowledge are the generous teachers.Their knowledge of ideas about art are just as important as their practical skills and they might not paint they way you want to paint but you are left with food for thought and you yourself have to work through the process to move your own art forwards,painful as that might be.
By reaching out to your site members and asking them for ideas shows a thoughtful process and speaks volumes.Wishing you all the best with your online endeavors.
I don’t want to earn a living from painting – it’s just a hobby for me. I prefer online workshops, which are interactive in the sense that you can follow along, and develop a range of skills and have discussions.
But, I like to have a core art textbook to follow too – so I’ve just got ‘Cambridge International AS & A Level Art & Design Student’s Book’, by Collins. It has fine art painting assignments, which can be done in a number of styles – classical style or impressionist or any style, which would be good to use in an online group.
I am not planning to do the A Level exam though, I just think it has a good syllabus which covers the fundamentals I can have fun experimenting with.
Hope that helps. Good luck!
https://collins.co.uk/products/9780008250997